SPORTS BJJ Crew...Guillotine choke and other dude stacks

rtzcom

bon wons! fight slepa for life sone!~
Jan 14, 2005
3,116
CT
Rolled today and this small dude tried countering my guillotine from the guard by stacking. I didn't sink in the guillotine completely because I wanted to see what he was trying to do and if it works. I assumed he wanted to try to stack and choke me with his shoulder on my neck. Never really saw it come into play because thhe bell rang when he was working it.

Is this the proper way to counter a guillotine? If he does stack, what could be done to keep the guillotine? I was thinking off going into half guard and crank from there, or push his hips down and put him back into full guard.
 

chechen

Brazilian Jiu Jitsu
OT Supporter
Sep 29, 2003
23,911
Irvine, CA
its a great way to stop a guillotine. you stack the person, and one hand goes on your opponents wrist. the other goes around his neck with your shoulder pressing into his throat. it's a very basic and effective counter to the guillotine
 
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rtzcom

rtzcom

bon wons! fight slepa for life sone!~
Jan 14, 2005
3,116
CT
I'm familiar with the same counter for a triangle, but never really knew that it could be used for guillotines as well.

So if he manages to stack, best thing to do is just to abort?

Closest move that I could see doing from there would be a headlock / d'arce since all I have to do reposition my arms and sit on my butt....right?
 

chechen

Brazilian Jiu Jitsu
OT Supporter
Sep 29, 2003
23,911
Irvine, CA
I'm familiar with the same counter for a triangle, but never really knew that it could be used for guillotines as well.

So if he manages to stack, best thing to do is just to abort?

Closest move that I could see doing from there would be a headlock / d'arce since all I have to do reposition my arms and sit on my butt....right?

stacking is a noobish and sucky counter to a triangle.

usually if someone counters your guillotine youre going to have a pretty good idea if you can finish it or not. if you cant, then dont waste your energy, and bail.

if hes inside your guard, how are you going to darce him? just let it go and do something else. if he had time to counter it, it probably wasnt sunk well to begin with..
 

AK-47

Banned
May 4, 2006
13,104
i like to do my guillotine different so it kinda negates the stacking. Instead of having your wrist blade under his throat, use your tumb and kinda flex it and have the other hand pushing on the bottom of it. Very tight.
 

chechen

Brazilian Jiu Jitsu
OT Supporter
Sep 29, 2003
23,911
Irvine, CA
i like to do my guillotine different so it kinda negates the stacking. Instead of having your wrist blade under his throat, use your tumb and kinda flex it and have the other hand pushing on the bottom of it. Very tight.

yeah five or ten finger guillotine. thats becoming the more popular way to do them.
 

FloppyCock

New Member
Jan 15, 2001
5,616
California
Rolled today and this small dude tried countering my guillotine from the guard by stacking. I didn't sink in the guillotine completely because I wanted to see what he was trying to do and if it works. I assumed he wanted to try to stack and choke me with his shoulder on my neck. Never really saw it come into play because thhe bell rang when he was working it.

Is this the proper way to counter a guillotine? If he does stack, what could be done to keep the guillotine? I was thinking off going into half guard and crank from there, or push his hips down and put him back into full guard.

Von Flue does this, and it is brutal. The only time I've ever gone out completely was when he did this to me.

If you can get good at that, you can surprise the hell out of people.
 

Redneck Shinobi

Well Jules, the funny thing about my back is that
Oct 27, 2006
7,460
Vancouver, BC
i like to do my guillotine different so it kinda negates the stacking. Instead of having your wrist blade under his throat, use your tumb and kinda flex it and have the other hand pushing on the bottom of it. Very tight.
LOL that's how I do it. It makes it hurt a shit load more.
 

brolli

Caffeine Pussy
OT Supporter
Apr 21, 2005
12,882
DEPTFORD, NJ
I'd say the guillotine is the submission I'm most comfortable with. The way to apply pressure correctly is to not extend the guy's body in your guard, but to pull him in (like you're doing a crunch) and start folding his head towards his stomach, while trying to bring your elbow closest to his neck down to your own stomach (in a twisting motion).
 

brolli

Caffeine Pussy
OT Supporter
Apr 21, 2005
12,882
DEPTFORD, NJ
so basically instead of stretching him like youre trying to pluck his head off, do a can opener

it seems like that, but it is the best way to apply pressure to make it choke. The stretching out method is what some newer people do which makes the pressure more like a neck crank where your trying to pull the guy's head off.
 

brolli

Caffeine Pussy
OT Supporter
Apr 21, 2005
12,882
DEPTFORD, NJ
If you watch joe stevenson against mishima, and his last opponent before kenflo, you can see he pulls the guy in.
 

Redneck Shinobi

Well Jules, the funny thing about my back is that
Oct 27, 2006
7,460
Vancouver, BC
it seems like that, but it is the best way to apply pressure to make it choke. The stretching out method is what some newer people do which makes the pressure more like a neck crank where your trying to pull the guy's head off.
I like to flatten the guy out if I'm trying to sweep him with the guillotine.
 

brolli

Caffeine Pussy
OT Supporter
Apr 21, 2005
12,882
DEPTFORD, NJ
I like to flatten the guy out if I'm trying to sweep him with the guillotine.

Actually something I noticed was that a lot of guys actually voluntarily plop to their back (so their mounted) to reduce the pressure of the guillotine when we roll. It actually sometimes gets them out too
 

Redneck Shinobi

Well Jules, the funny thing about my back is that
Oct 27, 2006
7,460
Vancouver, BC
Actually something I noticed was that a lot of guys actually voluntarily plop to their back (so their mounted) to reduce the pressure of the guillotine when we roll. It actually sometimes gets them out too
Yeah that's usually the case, but I usually do that to the ones that don't just roll to their back. I usually let go of it at that point and usually working something else.
 

VulgarTheClown

A child and a gun.....go together like apple pie a
Nov 18, 2005
9,427
Tamarac, FL
Rolled today and this small dude tried countering my guillotine from the guard by stacking. I didn't sink in the guillotine completely because I wanted to see what he was trying to do and if it works. I assumed he wanted to try to stack and choke me with his shoulder on my neck. Never really saw it come into play because thhe bell rang when he was working it.

Is this the proper way to counter a guillotine? If he does stack, what could be done to keep the guillotine? I was thinking off going into half guard and crank from there, or push his hips down and put him back into full guard.

Was the guillotine sunk under the chin? If so open you guard keeping the leg on the same side as his head over his back foot hammered and leg flexed, with the other foot put it on his hip and lift yourself off the ground angling to your elbow on the guillotine arm. Pinch your elbow to your body, push your hip and pull the guillotine.
 
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rtzcom

rtzcom

bon wons! fight slepa for life sone!~
Jan 14, 2005
3,116
CT
my wrist was under his chin, but I didn't crank it in because I noticed him stacking and I wanted to see what he was up to.

Brolli, I'll try the crunching movement instead of stretching out.

Ben, I can't quite picture what you mean particularly with the leg on the same side of his head. Do you mean keep it hooked or just plant my foot on top of his foot?
 

VulgarTheClown

A child and a gun.....go together like apple pie a
Nov 18, 2005
9,427
Tamarac, FL
my wrist was under his chin, but I didn't crank it in because I noticed him stacking and I wanted to see what he was up to.

Brolli, I'll try the crunching movement instead of stretching out.

Ben, I can't quite picture what you mean particularly with the leg on the same side of his head. Do you mean keep it hooked or just plant my foot on top of his foot?


The leg on the same side as his head is left over his back with your foot hammered (keeping tension in the calf taking away room) and squeezing him in (taking away yet again more room)

The other foot (say his head is under your right arm so your right foot is over his back) the left foot would go to his right hip (being on your left side) and you would use that to push toward your right elbow.
 

Maestro Nobones

Great Job! - GLAD DADS CREW
The leg on the same side as his head is left over his back with your foot hammered (keeping tension in the calf taking away room) and squeezing him in (taking away yet again more room)

The other foot (say his head is under your right arm so your right foot is over his back) the left foot would go to his right hip (being on your left side) and you would use that to push toward your right elbow.

ben if you would type all your instructional posts like this instead of the gibberish jiu jitsu shorthand that you usually post in a lot more people could learn a lot more stuff from ya :cool:
 

Redneck Shinobi

Well Jules, the funny thing about my back is that
Oct 27, 2006
7,460
Vancouver, BC
ben if you would type all your instructional posts like this instead of the gibberish jiu jitsu shorthand that you usually post in a lot more people could learn a lot more stuff from ya :cool:
Yeah that second one made a lot more sense then the previous post. I could actually get an idea of what he meant and I'm gonna try it next time.
 
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rtzcom

rtzcom

bon wons! fight slepa for life sone!~
Jan 14, 2005
3,116
CT
marcelo garcia doing a sick modified choke:

DSC_2915.jpg
 

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