EDU can someone explain "school choice" to me?

deadbeef

OT Supporter
Sep 5, 2020
1,600
if everyone can choose what school they go to, why wouldn't everyone choose the best school?
 

Rev. Johnny Vegas

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2001
107,269
if everyone can choose what school they go to, why wouldn't everyone choose the best school?
You're gonna need a POL pretty fast I'd guess.

But it's usually an understanding that the schools where students are zoned to may not be as good as other schools, or private schools. It would then give their parents the choice to enroll their kids at a better school in the area, or to receive vouchers/school tax breaks to send their kids to private schools.

For example, where I live, my house is zoned to Plano East HS, which is generally viewed as the worst of the Plano High Schools. If there was school choice, I could choose to enroll my kids at Plano West or get vouchers to enroll them at Hockaday (an expensive private school).
 

Disguy

Batman > Moon Knight
OT Supporter
Oct 26, 2004
2,973
It’s a nice way of saying that we’re going to take money out of public schools and SOME kids will be able to go to private school. Anymore and you’ll need a POL tag.

As long as there is a fair criteria for some kids getting a better education why is that bad?
 

imbored

Well-Known Member
Aug 11, 2005
85,709
OKC
As long as there is a fair criteria for some kids getting a better education why is that bad?

I can't answer this really well without this going POL

essentially it's how you accelerate the decline of schools which in turn fucks over gigantic swaths of kids that then leads to even poorer public education and in the US, where our public education is already fucking awful, this would be generally considered.....a bad move.
 
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Cashishift

Well-Known Member
Dec 12, 2000
60,044
Omaha, NE
so where I live.. you have a choice to choose any school in the district - you are assigned a home school, which is related to where you live, however you can attend any school. For example, I could attend any school in the district for high school EXCEPT 2.. which were extremely far away, and wouldnt have chosen them anyways. I didn't go to my "home" high school because all of my friends went to a different school.

I wanted smaller classes, and (at the time) a focus on architecture and the school I chose offered those.. with the exception of my class was the largest class the school had ever had (didnt know that, was born in 1980.. so not surprised) and classes that followed were even bigger. It worked out great, I am still friends with alot of my classmates and I wouldnt change a thing. Except maybe applying myself more :hs:
 

SkiMax

Well-Known Member
Dec 11, 2004
37,274
Chicago
As long as there is a fair criteria for some kids getting a better education why is that bad?
Why do some kids get a better education and others don't? If you take all the best performers out of the shitty schools then those schools are going to get even worse...
 

smell my finger

strive nonetheless towards beauty and truth,
Aug 8, 2001
98,277
N NJ
As long as there is a fair criteria for some kids getting a better education why is that bad?

it's not terrible in a system like NYC where you can have specialized schools for the top .01% of test scores, because there are plenty of good schools left.

it's a terrible idea for smaller districts where one "best" school will sap the intellectual and behavioral capital from all the others.
 
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Lazy D.

Well-Known Member
Oct 10, 2000
34,762
Canada
Why do some kids get a better education and others don't? If you take all the best performers out of the shitty schools then those schools are going to get even worse...
That's true, so if my kid is among the best performers, I need to sacrifice him by leaving him in a shitty school for the greater good of community
 

Disguy

Batman > Moon Knight
OT Supporter
Oct 26, 2004
2,973
because by making education better for the kid that can move, you're making it worse the one that can't move for whatever reason
There are three groups of people in this scenario:

1) Those who can't afford private schools ever (The have nots)
2) Those who could afford private schools with this (the have somes)
3) Those who already can afford private schools (the haves)

The haves are always going to be ahead and can do whatever they want / need and this will be marginally beneficial for them.

The have somes will be able to get a better education and advance their children's education and in theory future monetary income.

The have nots don't directly receive a benefit. However if education is poor due to class sizes being to large the reduced class sizes will benefit them allowing for more direct student / teacher interaction.
 

smell my finger

strive nonetheless towards beauty and truth,
Aug 8, 2001
98,277
N NJ
That's true, so if my kid is among the best performers, I need to sacrifice him by leaving him in a shitty school for the greater good of community
ideally all schools offer a wide variety of options for learners, so at any given school there are enough AP courses to go around
 

Disguy

Batman > Moon Knight
OT Supporter
Oct 26, 2004
2,973
it's not terrible in a system like NYC where you can have specialized schools for the top .01% of test scores, because there are plenty of good schools left.

it's a terrible idea for smaller districts where one "best" school will sap the intellectual and behavioral capital from all the others.

Rural areas won't see this effect them as much. Large cities like NYC, Newark, Jersey City etc. will benefit. There needs to be reform in how education is done. This is a very good measure to ensure that those who can advance will.
 

smell my finger

strive nonetheless towards beauty and truth,
Aug 8, 2001
98,277
N NJ
Rural areas won't see this effect them as much. Large cities like NYC, Newark, Jersey City etc. will benefit. There needs to be reform in how education is done. This is a very good measure to ensure that those who can advance will.

what is a very good measure? the broad concept "school choice" is too vague and looks too different in every district to be anything meaningful to discuss.
 

Disguy

Batman > Moon Knight
OT Supporter
Oct 26, 2004
2,973
Why do some kids get a better education and others don't? If you take all the best performers out of the shitty schools then those schools are going to get even worse...

Let's be honest. Some people are smart and some people are dumb. This is taking kids who are disadvantaged out of shitty schools and allowing them to attend better ones.

In some urban schools there are high schoolers that can't read or do basic math. Why hold back the next Bill Gates by making him learn with someone who will be a fry cook the rest of his life.
 

Matren

Don't worry about me, jerkoff.
Oct 4, 2001
152,634
New Albany, IN
if everyone can choose what school they go to, why wouldn't everyone choose the best school?
Because poor people can't just pick the best school, they don't have the means of getting their kid to them if the bus won't pick them up. Picking the best school doesn't fix the underlying problem of other schools being shitty, those that can't put their kid in a better school are left with a shitty school getting shittier as time goes on.
 
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imbored

Well-Known Member
Aug 11, 2005
85,709
OKC
it's not terrible in a system like NYC where you can have specialized schools for the top .01% of test scores, because there are plenty of good schools left.

it's a terrible idea for smaller districts where one "best" school will sap the intellectual and behavioral capital from all the others.

my SO works at just such a smaller district best school

folk are rabid about trying to transfer in

by and large the rest of the district is shit
 
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Disguy

Batman > Moon Knight
OT Supporter
Oct 26, 2004
2,973
what is a very good measure? the broad concept "school choice" is too vague and looks too different in every district to be anything meaningful to discuss.
Its a concept that gives a family a tax credit or some other monetary benefit to give their child a better education at a local non-public school. Will there be the same non-profit schools everywhere. No of course not. It's giving people options to advance their family's future.
 

SkiMax

Well-Known Member
Dec 11, 2004
37,274
Chicago
That's true, so if my kid is among the best performers, I need to sacrifice him by leaving him in a shitty school for the greater good of community
They should focus on making the schools better for everyone. I understand that if you are the parent of a student that excels then you are going to see it that way but that's not really a way to look at the school system holistically... I think probably the bigger issue is the continuation and expanse of the divide in socioeconomic levels.
 
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