SRS Sleep drugs

kdrweez

New Member
Jul 29, 2008
3,879
I've had a lot of trouble with insomnia lately, thinking about asking my doc for something to help with it. Last time (got a new job, needed to fix my sleep schedule) he gave me triazolam...which I just argued is super addicting. I took it once and just got buzzed for a few hours and didn't even fall asleep.

I have some melatonin, which helps a little. But as far as like Ambien and all those, is there a "best" to ask for? I hear stories about sleep walking n shit, which I'd rather avoid. It'd just be nice to get decent sleep on nights like this. Normally I'm asleep by like 11pm-midnight, but this 3-4am shit is a little ridiculous, and it happens at least once a week. I try to use the the extra time to get work done (self employed), but I loathe waking up at noon and being all woozy.

Recommendations?
 

half zip

Banned
Nov 23, 2007
7,846
I'd ask OTer Scootin, but in my experience the dependency issue with sleep aids is so serious I won't mess with them again. The more you use them, the more you can't sleep without them. I tried Valium for a sleep disorder and it just made me go on a half-baked late night eating binge.
 
Last edited:
TS
TS
kdrweez

kdrweez

New Member
Jul 29, 2008
3,879
I'd ask OTer Scootin, but in my experience the dependency issue with sleep aids is so serious I won't mess with them again. With more you use them, the more you can't sleep without them. I tried Valium for a sleep disorder and it just made me go on a half-baked late night eating binge.

yea that's just another benzo, trying to avoid those because ive had issues with them in the past. theyre addicting and apparently reduce sleep quality. just ned something i can use every once in a while.
 

Scootin

OT Supporter
Sep 4, 2004
111,871
Trouble falling asleep or staying asleep? How long do you typically sleep in a night? What are your habits before bed like?
 

Scootin

OT Supporter
Sep 4, 2004
111,871
Also, when you go to bed at 3-4am and wake up at noon, are you reasonably well rested?
 

Omega6_Virus

Active Member
Oct 20, 2002
6,320
Try Unisom man.
DO NOT USE AMBIEN or AMBIEN CR. They are EASILY abused. It's no joke. I can take 3 of them(CR) and not even get tired. It's just like being super drunk(with your thought process) and totally able to do what you want to do.
-Stay out of your bed room until you are tired. If you are laying in bed and cannot sleep, get out of bed. Drink a glass of milk. Read a book in a comfy chair or something until you yawn. You need to tell your brain into thinking that the bedroom is only for sleep and horizontal dancing.
-Don't eat or exercise for 4 hours prior to going to bed. NO CAFFEINE.
I used to work third shift, and I am currently out of work. It's been over 6 months and I STILL sleep like I did when I worked 3rd shift. Or, I stay up late and take multiple cat-naps throughout the day. IT SUCKS.
Good luck man. But try doing it with OTC sleep aids first. I tried Ambien(regular white tabs) when I was like 18. Then I realized how much "fun" it was when I would fight them and try to stay awake. Now, I cannot take any sleep medication(prescription or OTC). Mostly because I chose not to, but also because I don't think they would work for me anymore. And the next day feeling SUCKS.
 
TS
TS
kdrweez

kdrweez

New Member
Jul 29, 2008
3,879
Trouble falling asleep or staying asleep? How long do you typically sleep in a night? What are your habits before bed like?

I've started on parnate, that's the problem. Insomnia up the ass.
 

GammaRadiation

Well-Known Member
Feb 15, 2007
29,256
Random Location.FL
Melatonin is crap for me. If I take it before bed, I'll wake up in 4hrs and feel like I'm rested for about 3 and then it's too late to fall asleep again. It also does nothing if I'm not physically tired. Makes for even more vivid lucid dreams, though.
 

PrickleyPete

New Member
May 25, 2011
553
There is one generic called Zaleplon, not sure what it is called name brand, but it is not addictive. It will put you to sleep for about 4 hours but it isn't good if you have trouble staying asleep.
The good thing about it is that if it gets to be midnight and you are still not asleep you can take it and still get up at 7am for work.
 

Spiritus

Well-Known Member
Oct 15, 2002
19,323
I'm willing to bet my ass off that you haven't considered going for a nice hours walk after dinner and staying away from the monitor before bed.
 

Omega6_Virus

Active Member
Oct 20, 2002
6,320
Oh, I almost forgot. When I had my DUI class, my counselor would rave on and on about amino acid's that you can get. She talked about ones that would curb appetite and others that would help you sleep. I cannot remember the name of the one that helped with sleep, but it was 100% natural and non-abusive/addictive(she claimed).
 

Scootin

OT Supporter
Sep 4, 2004
111,871
Try Unisom man.
DO NOT USE AMBIEN or AMBIEN CR. They are EASILY abused. It's no joke. I can take 3 of them(CR) and not even get tired. It's just like being super drunk(with your thought process) and totally able to do what you want to do.

Do not use Unisom or anything OTC that contains diphenhydramine or doxylamine (which is almost everything). These are awful sleep aids.

-Stay out of your bed room until you are tired. If you are laying in bed and cannot sleep, get out of bed. Drink a glass of milk. Read a book in a comfy chair or something until you yawn. You need to tell your brain into thinking that the bedroom is only for sleep and horizontal dancing.
-Don't eat or exercise for 4 hours prior to going to bed. NO CAFFEINE.
I used to work third shift, and I am currently out of work. It's been over 6 months and I STILL sleep like I did when I worked 3rd shift. Or, I stay up late and take multiple cat-naps throughout the day. IT SUCKS.
This is good advice, though.
 

Scootin

OT Supporter
Sep 4, 2004
111,871
I'm willing to bet my ass off that you haven't considered going for a nice hours walk after dinner and staying away from the monitor before bed.
The problem here is likely iatrogenic. Parnate is well-known for its insomnia-inducing effects. Basically, going for a walk and stuff like that is going to do very little.

I'm wondering why he's on an MAOI, though.
 

Scootin

OT Supporter
Sep 4, 2004
111,871
There is one generic called Zaleplon, not sure what it is called name brand, but it is not addictive. It will put you to sleep for about 4 hours but it isn't good if you have trouble staying asleep.
The good thing about it is that if it gets to be midnight and you are still not asleep you can take it and still get up at 7am for work.
Ambien and Sonata (zaleplon) will do roughly the same thing, though zaleplon has an even shorter half-life. All of the z-drugs (zolpidem, zaleplon, eszopiclone) carry pretty much the same risk of dependency and many of the same side effects, owing to their benzodiazepine-esque mechanism of action.
 

Scootin

OT Supporter
Sep 4, 2004
111,871
Oh, and to answer your question - it's a tough one. A lot of the off-label sleep aids like trazodone can't be used with MAOIs, so your options are usually benzodiazepines and nonbenzodiazepines. Ambien gets a bad rap, but is a pretty solid drug. Lunesta is also very good and will help you stay asleep as well, but is much more expensive.

For you, it may be more trial and error than anything.
 

Spiritus

Well-Known Member
Oct 15, 2002
19,323
I like you but I politely disagree. I have practical experience using benzodiazapines and all of them are the worse.

In fact I tried one the other night for the first time in years (because I wanted to experiment and see if it helped with my TMJd) and ended up walking all over town at 4 AM in the morning in a complete blitz with no real objective.

It was only 1 mg Klonopin and I was safe the whole time but that crap is ABSOLUTE GARBAGE. It causes nerve damage and brain damage over long time use despite what studies say (some may support this notion).

Try a solid long walk, a heavy meal and a cup of herbal calming tea (if it does not conflict with your medication). If that still doesn't work for you then you have a lot of work to do on your brain's software in order to figure out why you are having such tremendous problems. Feeling stressed? Maybe you are too identified with the affairs of this world. And it's true, stuff like that can keep you up at night. This is the way I feel that the medical community should be headed and I am pleased to be part of a spearhead to let the world know it.
 

Scootin

OT Supporter
Sep 4, 2004
111,871
The problem is iatrogenic, again. This isn't some "I'm too anxious to sleep" or "I need to calm down before bed" issue. This is a side effect of a medication. A long walk will do as much to fix his insomnia as an aspirin will do to beat a cancerous tumor.

I appreciate anyone's view on avoiding sleep medications if possible, but this isn't really one of those cases.

I like you but I politely disagree. I have practical experience using benzodiazapines and all of them are the worse.

In fact I tried one the other night for the first time in years (because I wanted to experiment and see if it helped with my TMJd) and ended up walking all over town at 4 AM in the morning in a complete blitz with no real objective.

It was only 1 mg Klonopin and I was safe the whole time but that crap is ABSOLUTE GARBAGE. It causes nerve damage and brain damage over long time use despite what studies say (some may support this notion).

Try a solid long walk, a heavy meal and a cup of herbal calming tea (if it does not conflict with your medication). If that still doesn't work for you then you have a lot of work to do on your brain's software in order to figure out why you are having such tremendous problems. Feeling stressed? Maybe you are too identified with the affairs of this world. And it's true, stuff like that can keep you up at night. This is the way I feel that the medical community should be headed and I am pleased to be part of a spearhead to let the world know it.
 

Scootin

OT Supporter
Sep 4, 2004
111,871
And wtf nerve damage and brain damage are you talking about with klonopin?
 

Spiritus

Well-Known Member
Oct 15, 2002
19,323
And wtf nerve damage and brain damage are you talking about with klonopin?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDbPnAQ-c1o

...

There are tons of damage with that crap. Parts of my foot had very little sensation and it took like 6 months of healing to feel those parts again. I could barely move my pinky toes and that was only on my left foot, not my right.

This is just the tip of the iceberg of all the damage I suffered by using that crap.
 

Spiritus

Well-Known Member
Oct 15, 2002
19,323
The problem is iatrogenic, again. This isn't some "I'm too anxious to sleep" or "I need to calm down before bed" issue. This is a side effect of a medication. A long walk will do as much to fix his insomnia as an aspirin will do to beat a cancerous tumor.

I appreciate anyone's view on avoiding sleep medications if possible, but this isn't really one of those cases.

While respecting your profession do understand that my views generally are not friendly of medical science.

If he is stable and nearly functional without the medication and can apply a serious effort towards transforming his psychology and applying moderate exercise and healthy foods, I would recommend that he do that.

Yes it may be iatrogenic but why is he all hyped up on MAOI's and stuff in the first place. It is because of mental imbalance which is a karmic result of his past behaviors. There are a million of things that can lead to mental disturbance.

It may sound hippyish to distance yourself from mainstream culture and live a simple life but that would be enough to solve a lot of mental problems. Our culture generates a lot of desire and anxiety within people that pushes them past their limits and generates significant mental toxicity.

This is meant in a practical way. What I am saying here is the chemical imbalances in these situation are a result of bad thought processes caused by listening to music that numbs emotions, or due to a really bad attitude that was developed in order to live in a harsh society, the list goes on and on.

Psychiatry has distanced themselves from working with the actual problem and in practical reality the psychologists and psychiatrists do not work together. There is a large divide that is unacceptable.

We need to start getting to the real causes, the roots of the roots of the mental disorders. As a doctor I am hoping that these words ring true with you. I already know that doctors always apt for a change in lifestyle as opposed to medication so you can appreciate these words.
 

Spiritus

Well-Known Member
Oct 15, 2002
19,323
I thought tea's like Gunpowder(the big leaves IIRC) tea give you energy?

Whatever is in the tea that I take causes me to drop about 2-3 hours later. If you are taking MAOI's or SSRI's the results can be the opposite or weird so obviously some people here should not go running strait into trying a bunch of herbal teas.

If you really thought that all teas give you energy then I suggest you read up on that. The human entity is amazingly complex and even light herbs can lead to effects within the organism. Modern medical science has been very critical of herbs and some have said they do nothing. Everything you take in has some effect, even if it is barely noticeable it can become part of the math equation and sometimes the subtle effect is the one that makes the big difference.
 

Scootin

OT Supporter
Sep 4, 2004
111,871
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDbPnAQ-c1o

...

There are tons of damage with that crap. Parts of my foot had very little sensation and it took like 6 months of healing to feel those parts again. I could barely move my pinky toes and that was only on my left foot, not my right.

This is just the tip of the iceberg of all the damage I suffered by using that crap.
That is withdrawal, not damage. There is a tremendous difference. Withdrawal of that severity is typically associates with abuse and only very rarely with therapeutic use.
 

Scootin

OT Supporter
Sep 4, 2004
111,871
I suppose I can't argue a point when your belief is that pathology resides in the intangible. Seems silly to ignore what's in front of your face for some more complicated explanation with no basis in science.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

About Us

  • Please do not post anything that violates any Local, State, Federal or International Laws. Your privacy is protected. You have the right to be forgotten. Site funded by advertising, link monetization and member support.
OT v15.8.1 Copyright © 2000-2022 Offtopic.com
Served by fu.offtopic.com

Online statistics

Members online
491
Guests online
90
Total visitors
581

Forum statistics

Threads
369,739
Messages
16,915,682
Members
86,875
Latest member
ddunn9448